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I would concur that 40 F is about the limit for working with epoxy. Eastern ID in winter would be a problem without some sort of heating arrangement.
On the other extreme, sort of, where I live it never gets particularly warm.....daily range is high 30s to low 50s winter, and high 40s to high 50s, low 60s summer...coastal CA.
Consequently I chose System 3 silver tip resin with fast hardene
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Larry, I measured the stem angle on one of the more popular aluminum drift boats made in Medford, OR....it had a stem angle of approximately 107 degrees. Quite a radical entry. Based on my measurement of a 16 x 54 model - the side panel was 16' 10", the stem cut out was 21", the transom cut out 13". The chine was 14' (168" if I multiply correctly), same as the Hon
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Stem entry angle and dory performance in waves was commented on by Randy Dersham over on WBP a while back. My quick search didn't find the discussion. My recollection is that he made the point you experienced on the Colorado. If the stem entry has serious angle the boat will drop over a wave until the hull contacts water, and may dig into the following wave and take on a lot of water. A
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
If you build without a stem, an epoxy filet is used instead. MBB boats are built open side up, the bottom is stitched inside the side panels, and stretchers are used at the shear to establish the side flair and rocker. The bottom panel is critical to establishing the lines of the boat. A breast hook is used at the shear, and fly deck is epoxied in, to add strength to the stem.
MRB boats are
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Tungsten - consider epoxy pigment rather than paint for the bottom, as a substitute for graphite. It comes in various colors. One source is System 3. Other suppliers must have equivalent products.
Last year I did a number of experiments with paint: Ben Moore Porch Alkyd Porch Paint, Interlux Toplac and Brightsides alkyd marine paint, System 3 Waterbased 2 Part LPU.
Hardness performance:
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Yes, that was me. You did thank me just after it arrived. The material is from Sweet Composites, purchased more than a decade ago to be used in canoe skid plate construction....and never used.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
If this is a car top boat and you don't want to use graphite, just consider painting to protect the epoxy. It will wear off and need to be redone.....but maintenance is the cost of owning any boat.
For abrasion resistance you may want to consider a final layer of dynel over the glass.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The 24 11/16 is the depth of the boat at that station. The 26 3/4 is the dimension of the side panel at that station. The 26 3/4 is the hypotenuse (sic?) of the right triangle formed by the depth and side flare at station 1.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The skin material is an essential feature, along with the strength of the bond of the skin to the core. Think Titanic, think space shuttle Challenger. Skin failure in both instances. In the case of Challenger, a piece of foam penetrating the skin!
Thicker core may help with reducing the tendency for the core to deform under localized impact (rock). But what is the appropriate skin for pene
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Interesting topic.
From Don's description of the board construction it appears to me that in his application D-cell was used as a structural element in various surfaces of the board. The entire board is a torsion box - the foam core serves as the torsion box core and the D-cell, wood, and glass are the outer skins.
In Sandy and Larry's discussion plascore, D-cell, or Core-cell, a
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
System 3 and West both market epoxy adhesives for oily woods. If you used System 3 gel magic or T88 you may want to give one of the other specialty adhesives a try.
However, isn't Ipe really heavy. My gunnels are cvg Doug Fir. If I need to replace them at some point I'll use Port Orford or Alaskan Yellow cedar, or Sitka spruce. They will get a bit more banged up than oak or ash,
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Started a new thread rather than adding this to the curved bottom discussion. A great way to reduce the likelihood of having an anchor swing and bang the transom is to attach it without a loop through the anchor eye-bolt. AJ may provide some link to previous discussion on this topic here, at at Woodenboatpeople. He was the source of the solution I use.
What I do is run the anchor rope throu
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Thought an update on System 3 LPU was in order since there is (always) interest in paint topics.
I supervise a freshwater laboratory/fish hatchery for a state university. Some of the tanks we are use for ESA listed annual fishes (gobies) had hydroteck covers that needed glassing and paint so they would last along time.
So, I used that as an opportunity to test application and durability of
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
That is a nifty idea. Especially the part about being able to have your boat and a small trailer too. However, it is only a one person boat. From your earlier message about having someone with a small Honda serve as your shuttle driver.... seems like someone else lives in the house with you!
When I was a post-doc decades ago my wife took up an offer to spend a week in a small trailer with o
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
Probably the solvents in the bedliner lifted the paint off the epoxy. For similar reasons you cannot use a two-part urethane paint (interlux or epifanes) over their one-part alkyd urethane enamels. The solvent in the two-part dissolves the one-part and the whole thing fails to cure.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
System 3 sells 4 oz samples of their waterbased LPU; the samples do not come with the hardener (activator).
I've been experimenting with some of their samples on a non-boat project and think the product has a number of features that warrant a close look by the dory building community.
The WR-LPU is not inexpensive - just under $50.00 quart, something like $186 for gallons. However, it
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The big Rogue River rapid is Blossom Bar - class IV. Some say it mellows at extreme flows. One of my open canoe friends that has been down the Middle Fork and Main Salmon several times was scared poopless at Blossom and won't go back again. The early river runners on the Rogue blasted a route through several impassable drops so mail boats and log drivers could get through. Blossom was on
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The wood strip along the side of the boat, just above the chine is called the rub rail. Back in the old days boat trailers did not have bunks and the tires were not covered with fenders. These rub rails kept the boats from being worn by the tires.
I've no solution for removing the varnish between the rub rail and the chine, except using a narrower scraper.
Fill the screw holes in the
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
I would spend my money on a cheap electronic balance. I used pumps for a while to get epoxy out of the large container and into smaller bottles, and then poured out of those into containers on the balance. Worked great, but over time epoxy crystalized in the pumps and it was a pain to clean. Now is just pour from the gallon jugs into a half-liter (half-quart) bottle, and then pour from those c
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
If your fishing date is in mid-September steelhead on the Klamath, Rogue, Deschutes, huge rainbows chasing hoppers on the Williamson River and upper Klamath Lake in Oregon.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
My boat has a cover, but sits outside and is used about 20 days a year. The varnish lasts 2 years. Light sanding with follow-up of wipe-on technique takes a couple days (3 coats per day about an hour apart, cure overnight, light sanding, 3 more coats and hour apart, repeat if you want more depth).
Larry oils once a month. I never oiled that often with my canoe and the gunnels decayed - I kn
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
All of the approaches you suggest are used by finishers. Many will provide their opinion of why they elect the method they prefer. In the end you will need to decide on your method of choice.
There is a handy little book titled: The brightwork companion - tried and true methods and strongly held opinions (on the art of bright finished wood) by Rebecca J. Wittman. She is devote fan of va
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The problems you describe with epoxy joints suggest the material may not have cured long enough. Or perhaps the joint was starved for adhesive. When using epoxy as an adhesive you should use unthickened epoxy to coat and soak into the wood, you can even let it cure, then join the wood with epoxy adhesive of some type. Wood flour may not be the best choice for thickening to create an adhesive.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The treat about width mentions scarfing the added bottom width when using plywood. Is this really needed? Would a butt joint work just as well considering the glue joint is as strong as the wood, and covered in glass? Dynamite Payton had an article where he butt joined plywood, covered it in glass, and then smashed it. It did not break on the glue joint.
In addition to improved strength, s
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
The text below is from the Sweet Composites website. They support Sandy's contention that the best place for kevlar is on the inside.
For full disclosure - I used kevlar on the inside and outside of my s&g drift boat with a 9 mm merranti bottom, but did so only cause it might reduce weight in the layup and add toughness to the bottom. I fully recognize Sandy's concern that shat
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
All of the core materials use a different construction principle than plywood. In plywood construction the wood is the structural element, epoxy seals it, and the glass protects the epoxy and stiffens the wood. In core construction - foam core and honeycomb (plascore/nidacore) - the fiberglass skins are the structural element. The core material keeps them a distance apart and creates an I-beam
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
I originally bought the dynel to make skid plates on a canoe, and can no longer recall why I didn't ever use it. I also was going to use dynel on my db but decided that the resin absorbing was going to add to much weight.
In recent reading one noted that standard dynel uses about the same resin quantity as 10 oz glass. Another mentions that flow coats use much less resin than glass flow
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
J. R. Sweet Composites
I have a couple yards that I have never used. I'll send half to Montana. You should get it in a week or so.
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
I believe this xynole is very similar to dynel. It swells with resin so often is vacuum bagged. It has much better abrasion resistance than glass. I cannot attest to strength.
If I build another boat I'll use it for the outside layer on the bottom (wood/glass or kevlar/dynel) in hopes that it has a bit more impact and abrasion resistance than glass. The goal is to decrease the dings o
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building
I use the system 3 materials and order from them directly, and orders usually arrive in a couple days. I also used the gel magic for scarfing plywood and extensively throughout construction.
Subsequently I picked up some of their T-88 adhesive. I used it to scarf ash gunnels for a canoe. Worked great.
I gather that you have purchased the caulking tube type of set-up for gel magic. I did
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Eric L
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Drift Boat Building